Comments on: Why deaf organisations should look to Facebook http://benfletcher.com/?p=179 A blog where creativity inspires Fri, 09 Jul 2010 18:31:20 -0700 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.0 By: Shane Gilchrist http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-218 Shane Gilchrist Sun, 04 Jan 2009 13:19:22 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-218 hey Ben, since when did u change ur surname to Sherman? :o Shane hey Ben,

since when did u change ur surname to Sherman?

:o

Shane

]]> By: MM http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-164 MM Tue, 23 Dec 2008 17:39:44 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-164 I think aggregates like deaf.read have proven you can have a 'community' of deaf people all with differing aspects and ideals. E-mail groups or any other 'groups' will stand or fall on who contributes. It wasn't the lack of technological gimmicks that killed them, but an a inability to run them properly. Even deaf.read has had a rocky time of it, and seen splinter groups doing their own thing. The same would happen to any social group only quicker, because social aspects are not campaigning ones mostly, youth are NOT Interested in campaigning. The sites you talk about are hardly campaigning 'networks'. Neither the UK nor the USA have the ability to unite the deaf sectors online, as things go, deaf.read does better than most. I doubt you can use a social site to organize long running or active campaigns of any note in the deaf read, NO-ONE has managed it. As far as bans go you and I are i are rather a select group aren't we lol :) I'm convinced the power of facebook for the deaf via meaningful campaigning, in the UK it is a non-starter, I defy anyone in the UK to make one work. More umbrellas just invite more rain..... forget text to text, try face to face.... once you mention committees and stuff, watch their eyes glaze over.....most won't even give a name.... it is easy to offer online 'support' to any 'cause' but we know where it counts, not one is recognised by the system, because they want names and faces, not anons... When they had a 1000 or so via petitions they laughed it out..... The first time you demand they fess up with a name, they'll run a mile... facebook is ultimate trivia, hardly the place for serious campaigning for the deaf. And I still say it is not a safe place for deaf people. When I used to peruse facebook when it started up, I could not believe there were so many bored bluddy drunken students in the UK.... at least deaf have attained equality there... There is a distinct difference between a group supporting deaf sport or something, and the BDA and their dedications to advancing the deaf 'way', there, I doubt socialising is gonna cut it, because you have to be in it for the long haul, and the drinking has to stop. I think the BDA does have some good people, but they do not have deaf support anymore, again I defy any facebook-style approach to change that now, they are bankrupt near enough how are they going to finance it ? The Brits have the best ideas, but have the worst follow ups ! We're on permanent self-destruct, because we hate success... If the system recognised online votes and power, we would all be laughing, the fact is they have as much disregard for it as I do.... I seem to recall a few years ago when I mooted deaf online power, I got ridculed for it. So either I was ahead of my time, or you are still on a hiding to nothing. Forget the gizmos JG, you have to get the PEOPLE. How do you think people managed to campaign before the net ? and it seems they were a lot more effective too... I think aggregates like deaf.read have proven you can have a ‘community’ of deaf people all with differing aspects and ideals. E-mail groups or any other ‘groups’ will stand or fall on who contributes. It wasn’t the lack of technological gimmicks that killed them, but an a inability to run them properly. Even deaf.read has had a rocky time of it, and seen splinter groups doing their own thing. The same would happen to any social group only quicker, because social aspects are not campaigning ones mostly, youth are NOT Interested in campaigning. The sites you talk about are hardly campaigning ‘networks’. Neither the UK nor the USA have the ability to unite the deaf sectors online, as things go, deaf.read does better than most. I doubt you can use a social site to organize long running or active campaigns of any note in the deaf read, NO-ONE has managed it. As far as bans go you and I are i are rather a select group aren’t we lol :)

I’m convinced the power of facebook for the deaf via meaningful campaigning, in the UK it is a non-starter, I defy anyone in the UK to make one work. More umbrellas just invite more rain….. forget text to text, try face to face…. once you mention committees and stuff, watch their eyes glaze over…..most won’t even give a name…. it is easy to offer online ‘support’ to any ’cause’ but we know where it counts, not one is recognised by the system, because they want names and faces, not anons… When they had a 1000 or so via petitions they laughed it out….. The first time you demand they fess up with a name, they’ll run a mile… facebook is ultimate trivia, hardly the place for serious campaigning for the deaf. And I still say it is not a safe place for deaf people. When I used to peruse facebook when it started up, I could not believe there were so many bored bluddy drunken students in the UK…. at least deaf have attained equality there…

There is a distinct difference between a group supporting deaf sport or something, and the BDA and their dedications to advancing the deaf ‘way’, there, I doubt socialising is gonna cut it, because you have to be in it for the long haul, and the drinking has to stop. I think the BDA does have some good people, but they do not have deaf support anymore, again I defy any facebook-style approach to change that now, they are bankrupt near enough how are they going to finance it ? The Brits have the best ideas, but have the worst follow ups ! We’re on permanent self-destruct, because we hate success… If the system recognised online votes and power, we would all be laughing, the fact is they have as much disregard for it as I do…. I seem to recall a few years ago when I mooted deaf online power, I got ridculed for it. So either I was ahead of my time, or you are still on a hiding to nothing. Forget the gizmos JG, you have to get the PEOPLE. How do you think people managed to campaign before the net ? and it seems they were a lot more effective too…

]]> By: Richard Roehm http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-163 Richard Roehm Tue, 23 Dec 2008 16:54:43 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-163 We use facebook to round up most of our volunteers. We're able to tell people what our cause is all about and how they can support us. It's a novel marketing gimmick. We use facebook to round up most of our volunteers. We’re able to tell people what our cause is all about and how they can support us. It’s a novel marketing gimmick.

]]> By: JGJones http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-161 JGJones Tue, 23 Dec 2008 14:00:56 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-161 While MM does indeed view it as a bunch of "young drunks" - I'll have to say I agree with you rather...I also see many smaller more specialised groups such as the Deaf Parenting, deaf football teams, even Rugby (MM you should at least be glad to know that Wales Deaf Rugby team regularly trash England Deaf team and is the current world champions :D). They do happen to have social events where they get together to have fun - ie "get drunk" which might give MM that impression...however they all do serious hard work in their specialised field. However not all of them just "get drunk"...like the Deaf Camp events...where parents can bring children etc - it get bigger every year with more people turning up...and they are hardly likely to run around getting drunk especially with children being around! And indeed I can see why your idea of using the Facebook's model would be ideal for this kind of thing - BDA/RNID etc can't do everything, but a network of network linking them all where people are much more dedicated to their unique field and thus do much more is a good idea. They do well like you said...and are keen on it too - to really make a success of something you need passion and they have that in spades. And with passion...they can achieve much more. BUT...as you have mentioned those deaf e-groups...I might think making use of something like Facebook might be better - BDA wouldn't have the resources to create something like this at all. Furthermore it cannot be under control of a small handful of people - this is primarily what killed off the old deaf egroups (such as the mailing lists) - they failed to move on with technology and recent events in a certain UK based mailing list made use of heavy censorship and the banning of a large number of people without warning etc - this essentially killed it off and you don't see debates on them anymore....there are still postings, but mainly just events notifications. So who should be the caretaker of all this network of networks? That's the key question. As it is...most of those groups are starting to make use of Facebook itself so perhaps without any plans to do so, they are already developing toward this concept. All they need is this umberella that you mention where one might just find any other deaf groups in a field that they are interested in. Hope that made sense. While MM does indeed view it as a bunch of “young drunks” – I’ll have to say I agree with you rather…I also see many smaller more specialised groups such as the Deaf Parenting, deaf football teams, even Rugby (MM you should at least be glad to know that Wales Deaf Rugby team regularly trash England Deaf team and is the current world champions :D ). They do happen to have social events where they get together to have fun – ie “get drunk” which might give MM that impression…however they all do serious hard work in their specialised field. However not all of them just “get drunk”…like the Deaf Camp events…where parents can bring children etc – it get bigger every year with more people turning up…and they are hardly likely to run around getting drunk especially with children being around!

And indeed I can see why your idea of using the Facebook’s model would be ideal for this kind of thing – BDA/RNID etc can’t do everything, but a network of network linking them all where people are much more dedicated to their unique field and thus do much more is a good idea. They do well like you said…and are keen on it too – to really make a success of something you need passion and they have that in spades. And with passion…they can achieve much more.

BUT…as you have mentioned those deaf e-groups…I might think making use of something like Facebook might be better – BDA wouldn’t have the resources to create something like this at all. Furthermore it cannot be under control of a small handful of people – this is primarily what killed off the old deaf egroups (such as the mailing lists) – they failed to move on with technology and recent events in a certain UK based mailing list made use of heavy censorship and the banning of a large number of people without warning etc – this essentially killed it off and you don’t see debates on them anymore….there are still postings, but mainly just events notifications.

So who should be the caretaker of all this network of networks? That’s the key question. As it is…most of those groups are starting to make use of Facebook itself so perhaps without any plans to do so, they are already developing toward this concept. All they need is this umberella that you mention where one might just find any other deaf groups in a field that they are interested in. Hope that made sense.

]]> By: Ben http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-160 Ben Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:15:11 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-160 MM, it's the "model" Facebook uses that I'm interested in. This model doesn't need to be done over the computer, it can be done through traditional methods (mailing, meeting in person, etc.). The philosophy is: allow deaf people to form their own social networks (in person, if you like, doesn't have to be through computers), and grow them to achieve their common interests/goals. Unified actions would be to provide support to these networks that deaf people grow, give them encouragement, help with publicity, advise on lobbying/campaigning, etc. I.e., to champion diversity. It's interesting to see your view that deaf networks today are just young drunks ;-) but if you look closer, you may find networks like: Deaf Parenting, deaf football teams (we won the deaf world cup!), Mary Hare networks, See Hear, Deaf Professionals Network, UsherLife, etc. These are doing really well and are keen to make a difference in their own ways. MM, it’s the “model” Facebook uses that I’m interested in. This model doesn’t need to be done over the computer, it can be done through traditional methods (mailing, meeting in person, etc.). The philosophy is: allow deaf people to form their own social networks (in person, if you like, doesn’t have to be through computers), and grow them to achieve their common interests/goals.

Unified actions would be to provide support to these networks that deaf people grow, give them encouragement, help with publicity, advise on lobbying/campaigning, etc. I.e., to champion diversity.

It’s interesting to see your view that deaf networks today are just young drunks ;-) but if you look closer, you may find networks like: Deaf Parenting, deaf football teams (we won the deaf world cup!), Mary Hare networks, See Hear, Deaf Professionals Network, UsherLife, etc. These are doing really well and are keen to make a difference in their own ways.

]]> By: MM http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-159 MM Tue, 23 Dec 2008 12:02:32 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-159 You forgot the cons, lack of security, hacking, putting vulnerable deaf at risk, you have NO Idea if who is posting is even deaf at all, and a friend facebook-wise is just print. Personally I think Deaf groups have left it all about 10 years too late. What motivated deaf action was meeting up ion person, not posting total strangers e-mails. The BDA may not exist in 5 years time, and, they cannot function with feedback, the BDA blocked feedback, and the RNID as we know never allowed it. Just because you can operate a 'closed shop' via facebook, does not address the real problems, which are divisions in the deaf worlds, that prevent any unified action. If you take the 'petition online' farces (Also organised via facebook), they came to nothing. I just see these 'social sites' deaf-wise as an excuse to close the door on what is happening everywhere else, a sort of back to the future approach where ONLY a certain type of deaf person who was compliant, was 'In', they area all doomed to failure, I suggest there is no 'community' to unite.... Statistically only TWO PERCENT of the entire deaf population of the UK is a member of any group. To suggest facebook would welcome many ardent CI commentators who may attack aspects of deaf culture and 'sort it out',is naive.... IT will be WW3 again. There are no 'networks' the ones that really work group wise are with youth, but then they just wanna have fun and get drunk, talk cobblers and leave campaigns to us old farts... The one redeeming feature is they will be one day lol..... Basically facebook is too risky and open to abuse... You forgot the cons, lack of security, hacking, putting vulnerable deaf at risk, you have NO Idea if who is posting is even deaf at all, and a friend facebook-wise is just print. Personally I think Deaf groups have left it all about 10 years too late. What motivated deaf action was meeting up ion person, not posting total strangers e-mails. The BDA may not exist in 5 years time, and, they cannot function with feedback, the BDA blocked feedback, and the RNID as we know never allowed it. Just because you can operate a ‘closed shop’ via facebook, does not address the real problems, which are divisions in the deaf worlds, that prevent any unified action. If you take the ‘petition online’ farces (Also organised via facebook), they came to nothing. I just see these ‘social sites’ deaf-wise as an excuse to close the door on what is happening everywhere else, a sort of back to the future approach where ONLY a certain type of deaf person who was compliant, was ‘In’, they area all doomed to failure, I suggest there is no ‘community’ to unite…. Statistically only TWO PERCENT of the entire deaf population of the UK is a member of any group. To suggest facebook would welcome many ardent CI commentators who may attack aspects of deaf culture and ‘sort it out’,is naive…. IT will be WW3 again. There are no ‘networks’ the ones that really work group wise are with youth, but then they just wanna have fun and get drunk, talk cobblers and leave campaigns to us old farts… The one redeeming feature is they will be one day lol….. Basically facebook is too risky and open to abuse…

]]> By: Managed Voip Services: Go For the Best | Managing Network http://benfletcher.com/?p=179&cpage=1#comment-157 Managed Voip Services: Go For the Best | Managing Network Tue, 23 Dec 2008 05:48:17 +0000 http://benfletcher.com/?p=179#comment-157 [...] Ben Fletcher » Why deaf organisations should look to Facebook [...] [...] Ben Fletcher » Why deaf organisations should look to Facebook [...]

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